Hawaii becomes first state to put gun owners in database
  • Monday, February 18, 2019
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Hawaii becomes first state to put gun owners in database

  • ASSOCIATED PRESS

    State Sen. Will Espero, who introduced the bill, and the Honolulu Police Department say the measure could serve as a model for other states.

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Gov. David Ige is signing a bill that makes the state the first to enter gun owners into an FBI database that will automatically notify police if an island resident is arrested anywhere else in the country.

Ige said in a statement today the legislation is about community safety and responsible gun ownership. He says it will help law enforcement agencies protect Hawaii residents and visitors.

State Sen. Will Espero, who introduced the bill, and the Honolulu Police Department say the measure could serve as a model for other states. But critics say gun owners shouldn’t have to be entered in a database to practice a constitutional right.

Ige also signed legislation that disqualifies perpetrators of stalking or sex assault from owning or possessing a gun or ammunition.

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      • Thank you, Governor Ige, for keeping Hawaii safe. Thank you, especially, for preventing perpetrators of domestic violence and stalkers from being able to obtain a gun easily or keep their guns. Logic states that anyone who is against these reasonable restrictions must not mind when women and children are murdered by crazed husbands, boyfriends, and fathers with guns.

        • Don’t forget the woman who kill men. Ige just may have taken away the only defense that would have evened the score for a woman being battered. Now she can’t use his gun to kill him!

        • agree. Honest, law-abiding people have no reason to fear prosecution. Hawaii has a very low rate of crime where guns are used and that is nothing to take for granted.

        • A woman who is being abused by a domestic partner is far more likely to be killed by her partners and the opposite.

        • Cheese all, you obviously don’t have a very good memory, there are tons of cases of wifely self defense!

        • Marcus, I haven’t done a complete search yet, but seem to have problems finding a case in Hawaii where an abused woman, used a firearm owned by the abuser in self defense. Could you please post a couple of court cases where it happened? I know you said there are tons of cases so maybe 5 to 10 examples would be sufficient.

        • Although the intent behind this is noble, I wonder about its efficacy. Stolen guns with serial numbers filed off present a challenge. Also, criminals will still be able to get guns. How many murderers, mentally ill, and sex offenders are able to buy guns? Unfortunately, this legislation won’t stop them.

        • Kinky, I just googled ” woman who shot their husbands in self defense” and I found tons! It is not a stretch to assume the guns belonged to or were acquired by the husband.

    • Don’t forget to register perpetrators that have unregistered/illegal/stolen guns now! It’s not fair just keeping tabs on Legal gun owner, you hear.

      • Agree, and…have all the Dem polit-bureau members have an expalation why ATF is not going after black market/illegal firearms. Is there a reason to?
        1) 100s of shootings in mainland cities every month, like Chicago and almost NONE of them was committed with a legal registered firearm.
        No, if you are not 21+ you cannot have a legal gun, if you have an automatic weapon, its not legal, if you have teflon loads they are not legal either etc.
        2) There is no sharing of agency info to check a registration(so City cops do not get FBI or State ept. lisats and warnings
        3) There is no verification of mental illness or treatment for mental illness.
        PS.Since you can lie on your HI form and there is no verification(agency sharing, terrorist invest., mental illness, family violence), the Orlando could have legally registered and bought his weapons and killed 50 people here!

        • Don’t make things up. If this is a whitehouse fact, what they are actually saying is someone registered and bought the gun and then it was stolen and used by gangs and crooks. Please see my other posts.

        • With Hawaii being the most politically corrupt, one sided state in the nation, laws like this don’t surprise me.
          The Democrats can do just about anything and get away with it. There’s no danger they’ll lose power or control of every branch of local government. That’s why they were able to exempt themselves from state ethics laws and remove a cumbersome ethics director that was offended their public worker union masters.
          Just another day in corrupt Hawaii nei.

      • EXACTLY!!! Look at Prohibition!! They outlaw the sale and making of liquor so who profits in the long run…..the bad guys….people think by outlawing guns etc…this will solve the problem with gun-related crimes but the only people that will have access to guns will be the “bad guys” and the black market for guns etc…will be a booming business.

      • Yup and you just raised the price of a gun, cheap Saturday night specials, same kind they sell in Chicago, nobody looking at what comes into the state, like drugs, steroid chickens, girls…..just got to declare with airline, its not their job to check if you own it.

      • The bottom line is to make is harder for criminals and the mentally ill to gain access to guns. Is this airtight? Of course not. We need to go after gun runners. We need to make it mandatory for gun owners to secure their guns so it’s not stolen. We need to give access to gun shop owners to do background checks to deny sale of weapons to terrorists and the mentally ill. But doing nothing is NOT an option. I’m tired of our elected officials responding to these horrific acts by holding a “moment of silence”. It’s kinda like their mantra for not doing anything.

  • i don’t care about constitutional rights, i care about safety for human beings and this is the best thing hawaii could do to keep this island safe.

      • This bill doesn’t take your rights to own a gun, it just saying you need to registered it in a database which is prudent. If you are a legitimate gun owner, what are you afraid of? Are you planning to do something illegal so you wouldn’t want an FBI file?

        • From this write up it says “if arrested” so there is no requirement of guilt, just if accused and that’s pretty messed up. Any ways beyond that what do think the unintended consequences will be? My bet, people will stop registering their guns with the police. Bravo gov, & slick Willi you just increased the amount of unregistered guns in Hawaii.

      • Watching too much 48hours. When was the last time a stranger came into a Hawaii house and shot someone? Please. Only on 48hours,wife,insurance,love triagle,domestic,dog did it,business partner,disgruntled employee,scorn lover,only on mainland.

    • You “don’t care about constitutional rights”? Perhaps you should re-think that attitude or emigrate to Russia or China or *pick-your-favorite-totalitarian-state*. Then on the other hand, if Trump becomes president in November, you’ll have a comrade in arms. Get it? Comrade in ARMS. Get it? COMRADE in ARMS.

    • gajo2damax says: i don’t care about constitutional rights

      That makes you an enemy of Freedom and a traitor to this Constitutional Republic of ours ~~ in other words a member of the Democrat Party.

    • Silly person. As I’ve posted on other gun nut reactions, the most violent city in Aus. is Alice Springs. There are multiple deadly assaults and deaths weekly there. Not a bullet in sight. But how? Police report= knives, spears, machetes, clubs, axes etc.
      Can Aus. now “human-proof” the country?

  • Uh-oh! Let me make a prediction: the right wing gun nuts with say “Hitler used the national gun registration lists in Germany to round people up and confiscate their guns”….

    • I agree, sure makes sense?????? I wish our elected, career, politicians would spend their time on something more constructive, like cutting red tape and levels of bureaucracy.

      • Yep, somebody from Hawaii has to input data into Fed system, or at least pass it onto them to load into their system, more work…….have to hire two more government employees.

  • Let us wait till the challenge to the law is filed and tested in the Federal Court if it is Constitutional. This one may reach the U.S. Supreme Court in three to four years for a final decision to be made.

  • “But critics say gun owners shouldn’t have to be entered in a database to practice a constitutional right.”
    Such an argument is a fallacy if you understand constitutional law. Here’s why: The Second Amendment guarantees the right to have state militias–the very reason why a gun ownership clause was added in order to make the militia law abiding. There have been no state militias since the early 1900s. Thus there is no longer a constitutional right for individuals to own a gun–especially not assault type weapons designed to kill at a rapid pace.

    • Well let’s see, the 2nd Amendment reads as follows: “A well regulated Militia being necessary to the security of a free
      State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.” Seems to me that the government, either state or federal, should have programs in place whereby those who have “Arms” are mandatorily (sp./sic) part of a “well regulated Militia”. If anything, it seems that the government (state and/or federal) has neglected creating and/or maintaining said “well regulated Militia”. Assuming that is so, it is arguable that in spite of that (governmental) neglect, “the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.” still holds. Now, all that being said, I have no problem with keeping guns out of the hands of convicted felons, people with mental health issues, and people on the “no fly” and terror watch lists.

      • I might have a problem with the no fly list – which would probably seem arbitrary if its provisions were ever made clear.

        I’m also in favor of keeping arms out of the hands of toddlers and people who pull out on and fire at fleeing shoplifters in crowded parking lots or weekend Rambos who point their Desert Eagles off to one side to better squint at each hole they put in the 1x2s holding up their targets.

    • tigerwarrior says: there is no longer a constitutional right for individuals to own a gun–especially not assault type weapons designed to kill at a rapid pace.

      Two comments:

      [1] “District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008), was a landmark case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held in a 5-4 decision that the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution applies to federal enclaves and protects an individual’s right to possess a firearm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home. The decision did not address the question of whether the Second Amendment extends beyond federal enclaves to the states,[1] which was addressed later by McDonald v. Chicago (2010). It was the first Supreme Court case to decide whether the Second Amendment protects an individual right to keep and bear arms for self-defense.”

      [2] Anyone who carelessly tosses around the term “assault type weapons” does not know what the [redacted] he or she is talking about. From a functional stand point there are both automatic weapons (e.g. “Tommy guns” a la the celebrity outlaw era of Ma Barker, Baby Face Nelson, Pretty Boy Floyd, Machine Gun Kelly, John Dillinger, Alphonse Capone, Clyde Barrow, Bonnie Parker, &c) which have been outlawed for civilian possession (other than federally licensed dealers) since 1934; and SEMI-automatic weapons – – that require a separate trigger activation for each round expended – – which CAN be legally owned by civilians. Functionally there is no such thing as an “assault type weapon” (e.g., the letters AR in AR-15 actually stand for “Armalite”, the firm that manufactures the product, not “assault rife”). Also it is a meaningless term since literally EVERY weapon can be used to commit the crime known assault.

      • 100% correct AND every modern firearm is semi-automatic. The Orlando shooter did not even need a rifle. Just handguns with large clips. He could have killed 60 people without even reloading.
        I am also 100 % sure that just about every anti-gun comment and protest are from people who never used, learned to use or owned a gun. And that is why most the comments are so “stupid”
        Hint: if you wish to pass laws and fix problems you need to know the subject first.

        • Well, a statement like “every modern firearm is semi-automatic” would lead one to believe that you’re no expert either – or, have never been hunting. I claim no expertise in firearms, BUT….

          …There are plenty of revolvers, pump action, lever action, single shot and bolt action weapons still being manufactured for a ready market. Nothing un-modern about them.

          What’s more, I may be wrong but the only sill manufactured weapons that use “clips” are revolvers, not magazine-fed semi-autos. As far as I know clips for semi-autos went out with the M1 Garand and “broom handle” Mausers.

          Just saying.

        • Dear Tigereye, you have to seek out specially single action or single shot bolt action.All your popular modern handguns are pull the trigger it shoots over and over until you are empty. As far as pump action, you can get clips for those and many you just load the “under barrel” and shoot multiple rounds. The orlando shooter would have killed and maimed more people with a pump action multiple round deer shot firearm at those distances.

    • I agree assault style military weapons should not be legal but the constitution absolutely guarantees the right to own a gun period. Hawaii has done it’s best to restrict and discourage private ownership of guns with various rules, procedures, required training and/or waiting periods.Hawaii probably has the most restrictive gun laws in the nation. Corrupt Lawmakers here can pretty much do whatever they want since Hawaii politics are so one sided.

  • As usual, Hawaii’s moronic leaders show total disregard for the Bill of Rights and U.S. Constitution. It is totally reprehensible to put innocent people who have not committed any crime into any database just because they choose to exercise their Second Amendment rights. I hope numerous lawsuits are filed against Ige and the State of Hawaii over this miscarriage of justice. If the State can restrict Second Amendment rights, what makes you think they won’t try to restrict the others also, such as freedom of speech, no self-incrimination, etc.? A totally shameful and embarrassing day for Hawaii and a shameful day for the United States.

        • Does TMJ stand for Lock Jaw ?? As in, your jaw is locked at the 1st sign of a shooting, crapping in your pants because YOU’VE NEVER BEEN SHOT AT ???? Big deal your name is in a data base because you own a gun. What EXACTLY are you afraid of ??? Besides, the Constitution DOES NOT forbid a data base of gun owners. Ah, but some well paid lawyer may find a way to morph that out of something.
          I keep forgetting how brave a gun owner is, since they never use them when NEEDED !!

    • You do know you are on other databases as well for being an American. Like your IRS or Social Security unless you don’t pay your taxes or want your retirement. I don’t know what people is all upset about, no one is taken your guns away. And yes I do own guns and I have no problem being an a database.

      • Then you are being very foolish.

        The data base is the magic bridge the government can later cross to confiscate all privately owned fire arms once the level of anti-2nd Amendment hysteria has risen sufficiently.

      • Hey fool…now everyone knows where you live and what guns you have. So that they can come and steal them(a crooks shopping list) or Ige can confiscate them on a whim(and you hope, after years in the courts and SCOTUS, you might get them back)

  • What is the problem with being in a data base if it is a check and balance for troubled people who should not have access to any type of gun. I compare it to random drug testing. The only people who complain about it are the users.

    • Or DUI roadblocks if I havent been drinking there really is no problem. Common sense has completely disappeared and everyone has gone into the chicken little syndrome.

      • keaukaha: Agree with your comments. The government will never be able to make everyone happy when they pass a bill that pertains to an issue that they don’t agree with. It will be complaints about issues unrelated to the bill, and we’ll hear it from the same chronic complainers. The fact of the matter and this should be taken into consideration, It will not have an affect on the 2nd amendment for all law abiding citizens. The complainers complain to complain about issues because they’re the ones that fall under that category. Not until a sick person unlawfully shoots off a semi-automatic weapon at them or a family member, will then make them realize that reforms to the 2nd amendment should be initiated by the government…sad but it’s true.

        • Why is there no database of all persons who are mentally ill or have been mentally ill, or are being treated for some form of mental illness, so they can be tracked? Seems everyone screams privacy laws. A list like that would keep firearms out of the hands of the unstable. If honest and law abiding citizens are to be put on a government list in case they commit any crime, why aren’t other categories of possibly dangerous people put on lists too.

      • BTW if you register a gun in Hawaii, then dispose of it by selling or other means, there is no mechanism to remove your name or the gun from the registration rolls. So when they put you on a master list, you will always be there without a means to correct it like the no fly list.

        • If that’s true, that’s an interesting point. Guess I will need to buy my gun the good, old-fashioned way….illegally.

    • keaukaha asks: What is the problem with being in a data base

      The problem is that it can be used for purposes other than identifying unstable people. It is a sword with more than one edge.

  • As always, if the state of Hawaii can’t remain 100 years behind the rest of the country, we’ll at least pass the stupidest legislation possible to keep ourselves on the map and in the news. EVERY…SINGLE…UNCONSTITUTIONAL ANTI-GUN LEGAL INSTITUTION–from Chicago, to D.C., and coming soon to both coasts–that has reached SCOTUS in recent years has been summarily struck down and discarded, by the same court that also perpetrated upon the American people the liberal utopian disaster of Obamacare.

    Translation: even the progressive, Obama-cheering SCOTUS can smell the stink of unconstitutional law, and this new Draconian nonsense of Will Espero (loser and weird) and David Ige (loser and weak…and a one-termer) will end up in history’s garbage bin.

    Ige should ask Abercrombie for advice on what to do after getting a one-term boot.

  • Too bad Ige is the only Governor who is willing to put law abiding citizens on a Federal CRIMINAL database. Thank you, for disclosing to the world all the legal gun owners in the State of Hawaii.

  • As a supporter of the 2nd amendment, which is an individual right to bear arms, I’m okay with a gun owner surrendering their weapons AFTER being convicted of a crime. Not just being arrested. This law opens a slippery slope that removes any right to due process. I can see someone being arrested on a misdemeanor and having to give up their registered weapons. Arrested and convicted are two different things. The Bill of Rights is about individual rights and limiting what the government cannot do. Otherwise it would have said it protects the rights of state militias to bear arms. Again, this is a slippery slope where due process is being tossed aside.

    • Frankly, there should be court challenges to this law. This law only affects the law-abiding citizens (who duly register their firearms) and not the criminals (who, obviously, will NOT register their probably illegally obtained guns).

    • You remind me of the story of the guy who jumped off the roof of a ten story building. At each floor above the ground floor people standing by the window heard him exclaim, “So far, so good.”

  • Hawaii just started down the slippery slope of BIG BROTHER. The all knowing seem to think that the answer to gun issues is laws and lists. How about enforcement of laws?

  • Talk about the worst bunch of goody-two-shoes, brown-nosing liberal Democrats with their heads so far up their rear ends they can’t see the forest for the trees — that would be Hawaii legislators. Let’s make a new law just so we can show our masters in Washington how obedient and compliant we can be. We have the least amount of gun violence in the country but we’ll make a new law just because we can. We won’t focus on any of the real isssues facing our country, let alone our own state, such as the multi-bilion rail to nowhere project or the growing homeless population. That’s because when it comes to doing anything meaningful we are completely incompetent.

    • yhls: Tell us what the new law is about. The clowns in Washington can’t join together so why should the states have to wait while they bicker about an issue that majority of Americans are in favor for. The state has nothing to do with the rail system, don’t put the blame on the state, it’s the city’s project.

  • Let’s hope there is a legal challenge to this inappropriate law quickly. Making it hard for honest citizens to exercise their constitutional rights will not stop the criminals and crazies from getting firearms. Strange our State Govt. cannot do basic services right but quickly hang their hats on fringe issues.

  • Whats the Big Deal??…..This Data base existed in the FBI’s files before this bill was even conceived! This is nothing new folks,so don’t get excited.

  • Ha, ha, ha! Only legally registered gun owners will be in the database. Big brother is watching! What about all the illegal guns and owners on the streets?

  • No surprise here. Hawaii’s political elite and leftists are always eager to lick the Fed’s boots.
    And of course, those who register their firearms are going to be charged a fee to be placed into the Fed data base.
    Add insult to injury. Nice yeah.

  • When does prudent thinking turn into paranoia? Is it a numerical expression of the odds? If the probability is low and you worry about it are you paranoid? Gun registration is a good idea for the some of the same reasons that vehicle registration is a good idea.

  • Kinda mixed feelings on this but it remains to be seen how law enforcement will use this as an effective tool. Seems like an invasion of privacy and that every firearm owner is under watch as a potential mass murderer? At what point do they set out to confiscate? What if you are involved in a domestic but only in defense of a loved one? Driving under the influence? Many questions under different scenarios to be answered. If this works well then so be it.

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